Does anyone know about...

[wiggins]

Hi guys,
Can anyone tell me about the following mangas?:
Shaman King
Samurai Deeper Kyo

Also, I know there been some differing opinions about Shaman king, and there are alot of Naruto fans here on CAA. I don't know but I'm want to put forth this idea and see how it is responded to (A precautionary note: I don't mean to start up any fight): Is there any real difference between the suitability of content of Naruto and Shaman King? I think from the little I know of Shaman King, it has good values but the main character is a shaman and there's are all these shamanistic and pagan practices (I'm not sure if these are made up ones or real life ones or rooted in real life; please tell me the extent of going into pagan religions that Shaman King does). Naruto also has magic, in its jutsus I think, and rituals with scrolls and blood, and the main character has a demon inside him even though he is not controlled by it.

Another question I have regards Rave Master: Is the manga different from the anime? and if it is, does it go beyond the anime?

OK, another thought just struck me: What does the Bible say concerning magic like in Shaman King and demons like in Naruto? Maybe I'm wrong but I think the Bible basically says do not worship or obey demons and do not practice magic. Does this mean that reading mangas like shaman king and naruto are ok? I am just running myself in circles on if I should read the mangas. I have already read a bit since I didn't know much about them and enjoyed what I read... and then I researched and then came the question of magic and demon content. I think I should be abel to not let a stack of papers influence me... Well, do you think that reading mangas like this will influence me and make me stray from God?

I understand that the nature of this post may be a bit risky and I don't want to be banned from CAA. I am only trying to get some manga info and make some decisions of my own, and trying to see other's opinions so I can either agree with one of them or form my own.

To Admins/Mods: I am not sure if this thread is too risky or not, but if it is please tell me and delete the thread. Thanks!

Thanks!

God bless you all,

Wiggins

Edit: Maybe the thread title should just be called stuff... since it's not just on manga info... Can someone change it? Please? Thanks!

[uc pseudonym]

I would support Shaman King as a decent manga, if not a good place to look for philosophy. On another topic, I think your title is fine. My primary reason for posting in this thread lies elsewhere.

Also, I know there been some differing opinions about Shaman king, and there are alot of Naruto fans here on CAA. I don't know but I'm want to put forth this idea and see how it is responded to (A precautionary note: I don't mean to start up any fight): Is there any real difference between the suitability of content of Naruto and Shaman King?

I would say yes. Naruto has never claimed to exist in our world. It utilizes the fictional chakra energy (while the name has been borrowed, from what I have seen the actual chakra does not in any way resemble the chakra you may see in certain Eastern religions), which the creator blatantly says he made up for the purpose of allowing supernatural actions within the manga. Certainly, the morals within this world are not Christian, but it is meant as entertainment, not philosophy.

Shaman King, on the other hand, claims a real world phenomenon (shamans and the like) and has a blatantly non-Christian message. I would go so far as to call it anti-Christian. While I do not believe this dismisses it immediately, if we are judging its merits this must be included. Furthermore, its message is commonly accepted in the real world, which means it could actually be deceptive for readers.

While I seriously doubt anyone will attack others using kunais, there is a very high likely that our imaginary anyone will adopt a philosophy in which all religions are merely equal paths to the truth. That strikes me as far more dangerous.

OK, another thought just struck me: What does the Bible say concerning magic like in Shaman King and demons like in Naruto? Maybe I'm wrong but I think the Bible basically says do not worship or obey demons and do not practice magic. Does this mean that reading mangas like shaman king and naruto are ok? I am just running myself in circles on if I should read the mangas. I have already read a bit since I didn't know much about them and enjoyed what I read... and then I researched and then came the question of magic and demon content. I think I should be abel to not let a stack of papers influence me... Well, do you think that reading mangas like this will influence me and make me stray from God?

Regarding magic: in Naruto, at least, our story takes place in another world. The rules are different. This is nothing more than entertainment. To say that "chakra" is the same as "magic" is futile, as we really cannot compare the two.

Regarding demons: the Japanese word for demon as used here doesn't mean anything remotely similar to the demons of Christianity. If the word used happened to be "monster" absolutely nothing about the manga would change.

If you feel these will not effect you negatively, I see no reason why you could not read them. It's entertainment, just remember to take it as such.

[wiggins]

I would support Shaman King as a decent manga, if not a good place to look for philosophy. On another topic, I think your title is fine. My primary reason for posting in this thread lies elsewhere.



I would say yes. Naruto has never claimed to exist in our world. It utilizes the fictional chakra energy (while the name has been borrowed, from what I have seen the actual chakra does not in any way resemble the chakra you may see in certain Eastern religions), which the creator blatantly says he made up for the purpose of allowing supernatural actions within the manga. Certainly, the morals within this world are not Christian, but it is meant as entertainment, not philosophy.

Shaman King, on the other hand, claims a real world phenomenon (shamans and the like) and has a blatantly non-Christian message. I would go so far as to call it anti-Christian. While I do not believe this dismisses it immediately, if we are judging its merits this must be included. Furthermore, its message is commonly accepted in the real world, which means it could actually be deceptive for readers.

While I seriously doubt anyone will attack others using kunais, there is a very high likely that our imaginary anyone will adopt a philosophy in which all religions are merely equal paths to the truth. That strikes me as far more dangerous.



Regarding magic: in Naruto, at least, our story takes place in another world. The rules are different. This is nothing more than entertainment. To say that "chakra" is the same as "magic" is futile, as we really cannot compare the two.

Regarding demons: the Japanese word for demon as used here doesn't mean anything remotely similar to the demons of Christianity. If the word used happened to be "monster" absolutely nothing about the manga would change.

If you feel these will not effect you negatively, I see no reason why you could not read them. It's entertainment, just remember to take it as such.

So it's...anti-Christian? What would Jesus do? ARRGGGHHH! It was really cool from what little I read from one of the issues of Shonen Jump I have from before I came to London... Please elaborate more on what you mean by anti-Christian. Is it anti-Jesus, or anti-God?

Entertainment's all good, but I like to try to extract messages from everything I read...I kind of like to think that there is a good message I can learn from in everything even if it is mostly bad... Is that train of thought dangerous? And now knowing this would you modify your previous advice UC?

O, and can I also find out more about .Hack: Legend of the Twilight Bracelet? Is it more than the anime is?

[uc pseudonym]

Entertainment's all good, but I like to try to extract messages from everything I read...I kind of like to think that there is a good message I can learn from in everything even if it is mostly bad... Is that train of thought dangerous? And now knowing this would you modify your previous advice UC?

I would say that attempting to find a message in anything is somewhat dangerous. You have two good options, however: read only things you know have good messages or change your philosophy.

If I were to modify my advise... I'm not certain I would. Both manga have plenty of good messages that you could extract from them. Naruto's are the classic friendship things, and Shaman Kind has some excellant elements such as forgiveness.

So it's...anti-Christian? What would Jesus do? ARRGGGHHH! It was really cool from what little I read from one of the issues of Shonen Jump I have from before I came to London... Please elaborate more on what you mean by anti-Christian. Is it anti-Jesus, or anti-God?

I will elaborate (and I think Jesus might well read Shaman King if it could help him in his ministry). It is anti-our-God. The "God" character is respected, but is no more than a mockery of our God. Furthermore, the manga favors philosophies as mentioned earlier: Jesus, Buddha (both mentioned) and every other religious founder have all just been Shaman Kings of the past.

Basically, that says that everything that Jesus taught (and most other founders) is basically a lie. Nothing is absolute truth, there's just some good ideas that work for a while.

Did that help?

[SwordSkill]

Samurai Deeper Kyo deals with the life of a former lone fighter called Kyoshiro after the Battle of Sekigahara in Japan. It has a feudalistic setting, but you also get a couple of guns along with it, but being the main character, of course, Kyoshiro uses a 5-foot (or was it a six-foot) sword (can't remember). Anyway, the twist here is that this guy is schizophrenic - upon being provoked, he can switch from being a sweet, slightly-ecchi guy into a malevolent, ruthless fighter called Kyo (thus the title) with deep-red eyes (which symbolize devil eyes, if you're familiar with Asian mythos). It's a lot like Rurouni Kenshin in that sense, a man with a sword trying to escape the devils of his past originating from his involvment in the war.

O, and can I also find out more about .Hack: Legend of the Twilight Bracelet? Is it more than the anime is?

Um, what did you mean? ^^;; Were you asking if it's better than the anime or is it a continuation of the anime?

[skynes]

Someone may need to correct me on this but when the Bible mentions specific types of magic (OT somewhere) they all seem to be reffering to either contacting the dead or predicting the future.

I've seen adverts for that Shaman King, I didn't like the look of it. seemed very pagany to me.

[wiggins]

[quote="SwordSkill"]Samurai Deeper Kyo deals with the life of a former lone fighter called Kyoshiro after the Battle of Sekigahara in Japan. It has a feudalistic setting, but you also get a couple of guns along with it, but being the main character, of course, Kyoshiro uses a 5-foot (or was it a six-foot) sword (can't remember). Anyway, the twist here is that this guy is schizophrenic - upon being provoked, he can switch from being a sweet, slightly-ecchi guy into a malevolent, ruthless fighter called Kyo (thus the title) with deep-red eyes (which symbolize devil eyes, if you're familiar with Asian mythos). It's a lot like Rurouni Kenshin in that sense, a man with a sword trying to escape the devils of his past originating from his involvment in the war.



Um, what did you mean? ^^]

Is there anything bad I should know about it? And is Kyo really a devil or a demon? I went to http://www.animenfo.com/animetitle,933,mplzhx,samurai_deeper_.html, and uhh... it said something about the spirit of Kyo being in Kyoshiro...so umm is that anti-Christian? Is this manga anti-Christian in anyway? Would you warn me away from this or reccomend it?

I meant if it is a continuation of the anime.

[wiggins]

I would say that attempting to find a message in anything is somewhat dangerous. You have two good options, however: read only things you know have good messages or change your philosophy.

I will elaborate (and I think Jesus might well read Shaman King if it could help him in his ministry). It is anti-our-God. The "God" character is respected, but is no more than a mockery of our God. Furthermore, the manga favors philosophies as mentioned earlier: Jesus, Buddha (both mentioned) and every other religious founder have all just been Shaman Kings of the past.

Basically, that says that everything that Jesus taught (and most other founders) is basically a lie. Nothing is absolute truth, there's just some good ideas that work for a while.

What do you mean trying to find a message in anything is dangerous? When I think of "message" in non-Christian things, I take something like Trigun for example and go "Oh ia good message one can extract from here is the seriousness of death and killing." I don't go :"Oh Harry Potter! He's cool! I'm going to go practice magic now!"

Also, From the part about shaman king, do you mean reading it is basically like reading a story from another religion? Like norse god mythology, or Xun Wu Kong (I'm not sure how to say this in typed format in english, but it's a chinese story about a monkey and a buddhist priest that is based off the buddhist religion).

[uc pseudonym]

I merely am stating that perhaps not everything has a good message to be found. This could be dangerous, in that you will attempt to find messages where there are none and thus twist something to be a good message.

It is like reading a story from any all inclusive religion (such as Buddhism), except that it specifically says Christianity is wrong, in that it has no real claim on the truth. If you'd like to look at it as from another religion, that would not be too far off the mark.

[wiggins]

Uhh...Buddhism doesn't say that?

[wiggins]

My bad! I was impatient and clicked way too many times...can someone delete those extra posts?

Also, UC, when I search for a message in everything, I don't say that everything has to have a message. Just that if there is something good that can be learnt to be found, I will find it and learn it. Do you still think my philosophy dangerous?

[mechana2015]

Anyway, the twist here is that this guy is schizophrenic - upon being provoked, he can switch from being a sweet, slightly-ecchi guy into a malevolent, ruthless fighter called Kyo (thus the title) with deep-red eyes (which symbolize devil eyes, if you're familiar with Asian mythos).

Actually, it's slightly more technical... Kyo is literally a different person... body, soul, everything is a separate for him. The twist is that during the battle sekagihara, through unknown means his soul was separated from his body and placed into Kyoshiros body, which they share, exchanging control from time to time. The series is based mainly on historical events and people, though Kyo, Kyoshiro and Yuya are not historical figures. The series is quite bloody and has scenes of partial (but not graphic) nudity(generally from the back, but occasionally from the front...no details though), and frankly Kyo acts badly almost constantly when he is in control of Kyoshiros body (drinking, carousing etc.).

Kyo seems to be more of a monster than anything else... no excecssivly or blatently demonic stuff about it... just creepy eyes and the above stated actions.

The series seems to be set before christianity was well known in Japan, and religeon of any sort is barely spoken of. There are no blatantly christian charachters on any reference to Christianity as far as I can tell, 6 books into the series. Most of the techniques are hypnosis based or have a bit of a magical flair to them, but other than that its just straight up fighting.

It's a series for the older set for sure, with a very complcated historical plot and a lot of twists and turns. If the above stated issues do not bother you, try the series out.

[wiggins]

So Kyo is human with weird eyes (as if pink eyes isn't weird too), and horrible behavior as well as mad fighting skillz? Just to make sure, there is no full nudity or hentai? Do you see any private parts or is it just a woman's bare back? I want to be careful so I don't stumble here. Finally, last check, is it anti-Christian in anyway or anti-God or anti-Jesus? Does it glorify the devil? If so then I am definitely not getting it.

[uc pseudonym]

Do you still think my philosophy dangerous?

No. Your clarification makes it seem perfectly safe to me.

About Buddhism... I would respectfully disagree with you (if there are multiple paths to the truth, every path [Christianity included] that claims to have the only path to the truth is wrong). Besides, the manga-ka's other work is explicitly Buddhist, and the philosophies are more or less the same.

[wiggins]

O... I see... hmmm...It sounds like my neighbor who claims to be Catholic but thinks that every religion leads to heaven and that god is synoymnous with Buddha which is really wrong and my mom who is the one who mainly interacts with her cince I have school tells her she's wrong but she keeps on insisting that God will let everyone into heaven because He loves everyone... I don't see any more harm in Shaman King than in reading a chinese or Indian folk tale.... but I still have to think about it and pray over it...

[MasterDias]

Well, if you get any sort of message out of Shaman King, it should be the qualities of friendship, courage, forgiveness and so forth.

If you don't mind reading different mythologies, then you probably won't have a big problem with Shaman King, but it's really all up to you.

[uc pseudonym]

By the by, I cleaned up your extra posts, wiggins. I had meant to do so earlier, but time was quite pressing. Is there any further dialogue to be had on this topic? Are any of your original questions unanswered? If the latter, it might be good to reiterate them, as they've probably been lost in this tangent...

[wiggins]

OK...let's see... recap on unanswered ?s + new ?s:

Is .Hack: Legend of the Twilight Bracelet a continuation of the anime? Is it anti-Christian or anti-God in any way? Is there any things in it I should be warned about?

Is Samurai Deeper Kyo anti-Christian, anti-God, or anti-Jesus in any way? And is the nudity Mech mentioned showing of uh... private parts, or do you just see her back?

Is Hikaru No Go anti-Christian, anti-God, or anti-Jesus in any way? I saw a bit on the Shonen Jump website and it looked cool, so I want to know if I should get the GN when it comes out or not.

[Elric_kun]

ill answer your questions, but i may not be too helpfull ^^; (i read EVERYTHING lol even if it is 17+)

.Hack: Legend of the Twilight Bracelet - it happens after the game/anime and, so far from what ive watched/read its not anti-Christian; mainly just the game meets manga. I like it^^

Samurai Deeper Kyo - Ive only read the first and second manga so i dont know if its ani-Christian or not.....but so far i like it^^. It has blood and gore and it shows some nudity(upper frontal) somtimes hehe...

Hikaru No Go - Great series, really love it^^. Only read up to the 6th manga, and there's no anti-Christian in it(from what i remember)^^

[wiggins]

Thanks Elric-kun!

Also, is Rave Master a continuation of the anime?

[Elric_kun]

I think the manga goes farther than the anime after the 18th book or so.....I dont know, im just sad that the anime ended on ep.51 just like that

[uc pseudonym]

I'm almost completely certain Hikaru no Go remains completely clean and family friendly. Unless is bothers you that Sai is a ghost, there isn't that much objectionable content at all. Then again, I haven't read all 21 volumes or so...